Episode 108: Feelings From the April 5th Ordain Women Experience

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Join Lindsay as she interviews Ordain Women founder Kate Kelly and Jerilyn Pool as they reflect on their experiences at the April 5th, 2014 priesthood session.

13 thoughts on “Episode 108: Feelings From the April 5th Ordain Women Experience

  1. I’m all teary while cleaning out my garage. I had to pretend it was the dust I was sweeping out. Thank you for everything you said, especially Lindsay.

  2. Thanks so much for recording this even though it sounds like it was really difficult! And thanks for participating in (or witnessing) the April 5th action. I think you are moving the Church in a productive direction!

  3. I appreciate the variety of experiences represented here, the vulnerability and truth-telling. Our stories matter. We are sisters, all. Thank you.

  4. Thank you for this…I loved Kate’s explanation of the church and relationships, its very much how I feel…Lindsey, thank you so much for bearing your heart, my heart was broken too. :( The churches P.R response ripped my heart out. It was so adamantly untrue that it still feels like a bad dream. I have always been taught to be honest, church had a HUGE part in that growing up. The bad dream is to see such a statement coming from a church that taught me to be honest. BUT I really believe that some day, things will change. The civil rights movement took a long, LONG time to make even a dent, but it DID. The comment by Lindsey that “Being authentic became a problem.” really resonated with me. I have a statement around my license on my car that sais “Speak your mind, even if your voice shakes”. Yeah that fits me to a T, and the church taught me that. I pray that some day, there will be honesty in the P.R statements, and most of all, good, HONEST discussions in our church.

    As a side note…I know Kate asked people to look the April 5th action things, pics, video blogs,etc…you guys couldn’t post some of those here could you? People would be able to gain instant access…

  5. I appreciated this podcast more than I expected. As a rather silent reader of many internet Mormon forums and blogs, I’ve had no shortage of analysis of the event. So I clicked this on as I was making breakfast this morning, expecting to hear more of the same, and probably click it back off again. But what I appreciated so much about this podcast was the honesty and depth of your reactions, and descriptions of your reactions. I frequently listen to this podcast, and I also often hear you, Lindsay, on the Mormon Expression podcast, and I have often wondered where exactly you stand on so many Mormon issues that you find problematic, and on Mormonism as a whole. The root of my interest is of course my own journey, and trying to figure it out for myself as well. And although I’m doing this mostly in silence and privacy, I probably couldn’t do it that way if it weren’t for people like you who are willing to share their own journey, even the really hard emotional parts, in public. Listening to your story helps me figure out my own, by comparison and contrast. I would NEVER accuse you of attention-seeking for its own sake, and I would suggest that those who do accuse you of such a thing also benefit from hearing your honest story and opinions, and those of your guests, but may be unwilling to admit it.

  6. This was such a lovely, wonderful, vulnerable, authentic depiction of the events on April 5 and tracks well with my own experience. This will become my go-to resource to people who are wondering about what happened that day.

    Thank you so much, Lindsay, Jerilyn, and Kate for being willing to speak your truth. I have so much love for you all. May God bless you and keep you.

  7. I basically cried through the whole second half of this. It was a painful cry, but healing too. I have been trying to figure out where I stand with the church for a while now, reading, listening, thinking, praying. But there are few people I’ve talked to about it because I have been so afraid of the social repercussions. I think this has helped me get one step closer to being authentic about who I am and my personal experience with the church. Because, what right do I have to be silent? I think I’ll work on my OW profile after work tomorrow. Thank you so much for being honest about your experiences, I have been truly touched.

  8. I just finished listening. Thank you Lindsay, Kate, and Jerilyn for sharing your experiences as well as the others who recorded their experiences. I am so touched by what each of you said. I didn’t even mind the crying. :) I’m sure it makes you feel very vulnerable, but that makes it so real and helps me to really feel what you’re expressing. Anyway, I just wanted to say thank you for being willing to take down the walls and just be authentic. I appreciate it so much.

  9. Kate, Jerrilyn and Linds – I love you so much. I’m so grateful to know you and to have spent time with you. All of you sharing your hearts – such a sweet refreshment amidst all the mucky stereotyping from the other side. It’s one thing to feel betrayed by the church personally. But when I’ve seen how they’ve treated my sisters both times at temple square, I’ve been furious. It’s good I wasn’t there because I would have been the stereotypical angry feminist and I know that wouldn’t have helped the cause. Just know that I SO have your backs on this one – in any way shape or form that I can. Love you – Cami

  10. Lindsay’s comment about how it’s the niceness that hurts the most reminds me of a quote from Dr. Margaret Toscano, describing the end of her excommunication court, when the men wanted to shake her hand.

    “And then at the end — and this struck me as extremely bizarre on one level, that after he made the pronouncement and told me what it meant to be excommunicated, and the fact that you’re not allowed to wear your temple garments, that you’re not allowed to participate in meetings, that your name is no longer on the church records and all of your church ordinances are cancelled and so forth — then when it was over, everybody got up. In fact, they were just always so concerned about being polite to me, and they all wanted to shake my hand. It just struck me as so bizarre on one level, that here you’ve excommunicated me, which means that I no longer can go to the celestial kingdom and be part of the community of Saints, and yet you want to shake my hand and tell me I’m a nice person and that you really weren’t trying to do me any harm. It just struck me as so — [Laughs.] — ironic on a certain level.

    Then I left, and they wanted to make sure they walked me out to the parking lot, because it was 10:30 at night, and so there was this politeness. … In fact, I afterwards talked about sort of the horror of niceness — that on the one hand they’re cutting me off from eternal salvation and telling me that I’m this apostate, which really is considered very bad in Mormon culture, and then I’m this nice woman that they’re going to shake my hand. There’s something vicious about niceness that struck me in this — that the niceness covered over the violence of what was being done, because, in fact, excommunication is a violent action. And yet you had this veneer of niceness that covers it over. That was horrifying to me. Afterward it almost made me shudder, that incongruity between the violence of that excommunication and the niceness of the discourse that went on.

  11. Lindsay, Jerilyn and Kate, I echo Amy. Thank you so much for sharing your hearts with us. I feel so much love for you, and when your heart breaks, mine does too! As Kate said, those of us that were raised in the church and have questions can understand the potential social costs of these actions. I know I have repeatedly trembled at the thought of them. First, about the costs to me and my friends and family, and secondly to those in the LDS culture at large. But what about you specifically? Was I thinking you were somehow sheltered from it and that’s why you could be so bold? You, who have been so brave, to hear you express your vulnerability, in the face of harrowing personal difficulties, is truly humbling. I am so honored to call you sisters.

  12. I should have not listened to this podcast late at night because I am now upset and sleep will be difficult. Planting seeds of discontent and rebellion in the missionaries?? …. I am trying to be calm here …. But I cannot believe that you don’t see what you are doing …the errors, the workings of Satan …. This is all so wrong! I have read many of the profiles on OrdainWomen.org and all that I have seen are in direct defiance of the Lord’s prophet. Peppered with tears, emotion, and victimhood, they state their conviction that women should be ordained in spite of the fact that the Lord has not directed it. Concerning church-wide doctrine, we have one iron rod to hold onto, and that is the word of God…. through whom? His prophets and no one else. Not through you nor me. Whenever anyone feels they know better than the Lord’s prophet on matters such as this, then they need to stop immediately and rethink. They have lost their way and are wandering off into the mist. And attempting to pull others with them! Call it what it is …. This is sowing seeds of apostasy. Please, please don’t do this. All answers … your answers…are found inside the gospel through humility, and never outside of it.

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